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Verlander loses seventh as Royals shut out Tigers
by Steve Kornacki
Wednesday May 14, 2008, 11:19 PM
Detroit starting pitcher Justin Verlander, center, stands at the mound with Carlos Guillen, left, and Ivan Rodriguez as he waits to be taken out in the seventh inning against the Royals on Wednesday.KANSAS CITY, Mo. -- The Tigers were shut out for the sixth time in 40 games Wednesday night, losing 2-0 to Kansas City and wasting a quality start by Justin Verlander.
"We should not get shutout," said Detroit manager Jim Leyland, who had a former All-Star at all but two positions. "I certainly tip my cap to them, but it wasn't shutout stuff tonight. He was good."
Luke Hochevar, the No. 1 overall pick in the June 2006 draft, was making only his sixth big league start. Leyland said Hochevar and the Royals' relievers got his big hitters out by getting many to chase two-strike pitches out of the strike zone. He added that Detroit's hitters didn't adjust well enough to Kansas City's pattern of pitching them "backwards" with, for example, changeups and breaking balls in what are normally fastball counts.
The Tigers were only shut out three times all last season. They also got a quality start Tuesday night from Nate Robertson, but lost, 3-2.
• Wednesday's game: Starting pitcher Justin Verlander was good enough to win, but the Tigers were shut out for the sixth time. They've been held scoreless in 15 percent of this season's games. • Next up: 2:10 p.m. Thursday vs. Kansas City Royals (Kenny Rogers vs. Gil Meche), FSN. |
"It's tough," said Verlander, who is 1-7 this season and dropped his first decision to the Royals after starting his career with six wins against them.
"When we score, we do not pitch well. When we hit, we don't pitch," Verlander said. "We went through a struggle like this down the stretch in 2006 and were able to overcome it (by reaching the World Series). There's no reason we can't do that again."
Verlander settled down after a shaky second inning, never allowing more than one base-runner in the other six innings he pitched.
But the two runs Kansas City scored in that inning were all they needed with Hochevar shutting the Tigers down for six innings and his bullpen closing the door.
Billy Butler and Mark Teahan led off the second inning for the Royals with singles, but Butler was caught in a rundown trying to score on a grounder hit to third baseman Carlos Guillen.
That brought Tony Pena Jr., hitting .165, to the plate. It was an excellent opportunity for the second out of the inning, but Verlander walked him on four straight pitches.
When he fell behind No. 9 hitter Joey Gathright with a 2-0 count, pitching coach Chuck Hernandez visited him on the mound. Gathright fouled off the next pitch before slapping an opposite-field single to left that scored a pair.
Verlander said the curve Gathright hit was out of the strike zone and possibly headed for the dirt, but the scrappy center fielder made something happen.
"Things are not going against us," Leyland said. "We are not making enough good things happen."
Kansas City has won all five games with the Tigers this season.
Hochevar allowed four singles and three walks. Detroit mounted two threats against him. He got Carlos Guillen to pop out with runners on second and third and two out, and then got Marcus Thames on a called strike out with runners on first and second with two out.
The Tigers' best chance to score big came in the eighth inning against relievers Ron Mahay and Leo Nunez. Placido Polanco and Guillen led off with singles, but Magglio Ordonez hit into a double play and Miguel Cabrera grounded out.
"(Ordonez) got on top of it and hit a ground ball," Leyland said. "Obviously, you like your chances in that situation."
Detroit had five runners in scoring position, but couldn't bring any of them home. Leyland said he will start Ramon Santiago at shortstop and Brandon Inge at catcher today.
"Verlander obviously did fine," Leyland said. "He wasn't perfect by any means, but certainly good enough. We get three or four runs and he gets a win. More importantly, we get a win."
What another pathetic offensive effort. It's a struggle to watch this crap night after night when I know they're better than this. Maybe that's the problem, are they better than this?
This is absolutely rediculous!!! There is no way the Tigs should be getting shut out by the Royals! I'm sick of hearing all of the stuff about...it's early and what not, the more they do this the further they will fall behind. Something needs to be done (trade Sheffield for a starter if anyone will take him)!!!!
Bonds or Griffey? C'mon dude, that's not the solution. A team full of DH's is not what we need. We need to get back to basics with guys who set their egos (along with their home run swings) aside, and grind. We have guys that can get it done, their not playing though. Guys like Rayburn, Joyce, Santiago (glove especially) have shown they can spark this team. JL needs to insert some fresh blood into this line-up. Maybe grabbing some pine would be the best thing for them right now. I am shocked and frustrated at the amount of poor at bats these guys are taking. The rookie for KC, Hochevar is nothing special. He pitched OK, but worthy enough of a shutout?
On the pitching side, Verlander pitched average like usual. I have been preaching for awhile now about his apparent lack of confidence in his fastball. As Mario and Rod pointed out Gathwright was over matched on the first two pitches and what does Justin do? he throws a change-up, way to pitch to his bat speed. I wonder sometimes what pudge is thinking, and if he is not calling the signs, JL needs to rethink how he is calling these pitches. Verlander has a plus fastball, USE IT DAMMIT!
Tigers plain stink,i am sick and tired about hearing it's cold weather.Give Sheffield his walking papers,get someone who can play ss.Their offensw stinks,and so does their defense,with everyone playing a new position.Cabrera,i thought we were getting a good hitting power hitter,hell Granderson has as many HR.Turns out he can't hit,can't field'and can't run,what did we pay for this dud.
Yanktime
Wow what a night. The Tigers continued their decent into mediocrity and the Wings were outplayed by the Stars. Bad night for Detroit sports. As far as the Tigers go, whatever. Cleveland is starting to put some wins together to challenge Minnesota for the division lead. I said it before that this road trip would be key to the Tigers season. Looks like their letting it slide just like their batting averages. I just hope they get enough mettle to spoil a season for someone. Like by losing every game to the Royals so they can win the division. HAHA. Im done trying to figure this team out. It must be nice to make millions of dollars and not care whether you win or lose. The fans, who are they. Im making my million. Right Pudge, right Cabrera, right Guillen. Wheres the fire, the desire to win?
"We should not get shutout".
That's brilliant, Leyland.
Six shutouts in 40 games?
Tell me it's not April 1.
And once again, we lose and so do the Twins.
Done. I won't watch or gamecast again till they reach 500. What a waste of money I spent! VERY VERY disappointing. Can't stick a fork in them yet but the oven is warming.... they are almost done!
As I said yesterday, Tigers are done! They were done when they started 2-10! The tigers could set a new low this year like in 2005! Leyland needs to go along with the rest of his staff! You dont have a team with this much talent and still suck! Its very dissapointing because of all the hype and anticipation of the season, now just 40 games into the season and the tigers are done and we have to wait another year to get excited about watching these pathetic, lazy, overpaid, crybabies! I hate to be a fair weather fan but its time to start cheering for the cubs! Go cubs!
i use to enjoy watchin the tigers play but man they are stinkin it up.what the hell is goin on with this team.spending all this dam money on this team to be a a contender and they suck.The tigers won,t go to the playoffs this year.Their far too behind in a really good division.I don,t see it happening.I don,t even watch this team right now with all this losing their doin.If I want to watch a losing team i,d watch the lions.For now if u guys want to watch a winner turn your channels to the redwings and pistons playoffs.Thats some good stuff.
p.s. they should of never traded for edgar.They should of left inge on third and miguel on first and carlos at shortstop.
Wake up everybody. Dombrowski put together a Fantasy Baseball roster, not a cocktail for a winning team. Pin the blame on him, not Leyland. We all knew going into this year the pitching was going to be bad. Oh no, we don't need pitching, we're going to out hit everybody with our "Greatest lineup since the '27 Yankees". In 2006, that team won with defense and pitching. In 2008, both their defense and starting pitching is among the worst in all of baseball. They have 3 DH's on this team that couldn't play anywhere on defense, Leyland is afraid to bench/DL/demote Sheffield who is a shell of the player he once once.
Ask Dombrowski how Andrew Miller (3-0 for Florida) and J. Jurrgens (4-0 w/Atlanta) are doing in their new uniforms? You think the Tigers would redo that trade in a heartbeat? Get real. Keep Inge at 3rd for his glove and hustle, cut Grandfather Sheffield and swallow the $28 million still owed him (great contract Tigers), and roll the dice the rest of the way.
Actually Miller is 3-2 and Jurrjens is 4-3. But regardless, they've won seven games between them and have winning records.
And the Tigers have really only hit two home runs in their past eight games?
Every day, I'm astounded by a new lowlight for the Tigers.
Is it hard to be Dombrowski and read the papers, or perhaps posts about his team?
Maybe he can have a meeting with Millen to learn how to deal with it.
grrlions, do i look like such a hater now. this is absolutely pathetic. this team is a joke, we field a lineup full of DH's that cant get on base or knock in runs. Its pathetic and its not changing. Aside from the first half of 06, this has been this teams calling card, no big hits, no grind out at bats. pathetic.
There is an old saying that there is no I in team, but there sure is a me. And that is what we have, a bunch of individuals (as great players they are) and no team. Dave made to many offseason moves and destroyed the chemistry of the tigers.
I love Cabrerra on the team, however chemistry was lost with Inge and in a way, I believe, Maggs as he is no longer the face or future of the team. And moving Guillen around from first to third and back again is ludicris. He isn't very good at either of those positions nor is he happy playing them.
While we all fans keep blaming this that and the other looking for some hope that things will change, its not going to happen. This team is a 500 at best for the rest of the season and shall I say it NEXT.
The only thing that would give me hope for the near future of the tigers would be to trade renteria to the BoSox and bring back Casey, a proven clutch hitter, a good first basemen, and one of the few you could always count on in times of need. Let him and Inge share first base duties while Guillen and Santiago share sstop.
I will agree that certain players are alot better than others, I am a firm beliver though that the "sexy pic" is disasterous when everything else falls apart.
Remeber Monatanna going to the chiefs?
We have been shut out 15 % of the games. At this rate we are looking at 24 shutouts this season, an increase of 800% over last season.
I really hate to say this because I would love for the Tigers to come back and beat everybody up the rest of the way but it just is not going to happen. The glaring, almost entire failure of this team is very evident in the games with the Royals. You would think they would be especially motivated to sweep these guys because of the opening three games but no, they can't. Right now the Royals are a better team. It looks like a long year and is especially disheartening because of all the expectations. I bought into what they did over the winter as did everyone else, they looked like excellent moves. But after 40 games
give me the two starters back and keep Renteria and Willis. Really we all are wondering, "What happened"? This team should not be this bad. I believe most of the fault lies with Leyland. I'm hearing that he went easy on his team in spring training being concerned about some problems with arms in the case of the starting pitchers and thinking that he had a very veteran lineup that would take care of itself, i.e. that when someone was in a slump someone else would be hot and pick up the team, and that there were actually some players who could carry the team themselves if need be. Nothing like that has happened. Maybe there is some problems with the arms but they seem to have more of a problem with their heads, making bad pitches, and just not thinking on the mound. All of their statistics so far this year are opposite of what their career stats have been, more walks than strikeouts this year is one. It really does make you wonder. But as for now it looks like last place in all of baseball is their lot for this year. Because if the Royals can sweep them twice what are the White Sox, Indians, and Twins going to do ? There are 51 games left against these teams that so far they are a combined 4-14 against. Right now I have no hope and wonder where they will go and what will they do from here.
how many are blaming Inge now, still don't win when he rides the pine. This is the worst I have ever seen. For the last 2 years I have tried to watch every game, this year, I start watching then flip the channel never return. This is pitful. We all expected the best and are getting the worst. Pudge striking out w/ bases loaded, swinging at 2 pitches that were balls. I don't see anybody calling his a rally killer. Caberra only hits when there are 2 outs nobody on. Did not trade for him to be a singles hitter.
Boogs35....
The Tigers have only scored 7 runs in Verlanders last 5 starts.. Last night was his best performance. this team is now 0-21 when scoring less than 4 runs, and have 6 shutouts. There are no excuses for this, especially against teams like the Royals. Illich may have to make a desperate move to spark this team. They are capable of going 25-5 over vice versa.
Lets just face the facts, they are not good. what a waste.
1) No one said Rodriguez wasnt a rally killer. The difference is he is a lifetime .300 hitter and is currently hitting .270 something. Inge is not.
2) No one ever blamed Inge so SHUT UP about it. We could actually use his D right now but not at 3rd. Guillen looks to be finding his rythm at that spot. I think his knees are doing better and hes getting a lot better jumps on balls.
3) Cabrera is not bad at 1st. Sure he started out slow but who wouldnt. Have you seen some of the throws he's scooped up. He looks good there. Much more natural for him. Plus he has 7 years to work on it.
4) Hitting, hitting, hitting. Pitching is coming around where is the hitting.
5) Disagree about next year. Even if they do finish .500 they still look good for next year. These slumps will not continue.
6) I was all for re-signing Pudge for next year but now Im not so sure. He seems emotionless out there. Maybe its because of the losing but he used to fire the ball back to pitchers or yell at them or the ump. Now he just looks to Chuck for the next pitch. Something is up there.
This team needs more GRINDERS. It was the same the last half of last year before the offseason trades. Too much "All or Nothing," in this line-up. Polanco is the only every day player who qualifies as a "GRINDER."
That is why we need to insert RABURN into the every day line-up to add another grinder to the mix. We need one or two more scrappers on the field every day.
The problem is that Leyland disfavors Grinders in favor of guys who might "run into one."
And so, if you look at the history of this team since Leyland's arrival, offensively it has been an all or nothing type team.
IF THE TIGERS ARE GOING TO LOSE, AT LEAST LOSE WITH THE BEST PLAYERS ON THE FIELD WHO GIVE YOU A CHANCE TO WIN EVERY DAY---AND THAT INCLUDES RABURN.
Come on Jim, its time for another "Shake-up." This time get it right or maybe its you and your assistants who get the next "shake-up."
We need to cut out some of the dead wood and let these younger players work it out. Clete Thomas had a good April when Granderson was hurt, bring him up and let him play left along with Rayburn and Joyce. Sheffield needs to be traded or released, he complains he don't want to DH, but his shoulder is too messed up to throw in leftfield. We really miss Inge's defense at third, if we could get rid of Sheffield, then platoon Guillen and Cabrera at 1st and DH.
Not every team we face has fast ball pitchers. We can not hit a breaking ball to save our lives. What is Lloyd doing about this, it looks like nothing. Tigers have also forgot how to play small ball, they get runners on and try to hit a homerun rather than move the runner over.
The pitching is getting a little better. Poor Robertson and Verlander only give up 2 runs and loose. These young pitchers are looking good, we need to cut ties with Rodney, he'll never be the same. Jones is no better, I don't remember the last time he came in and got a 1-2-3 inning. Once Willis is back I would like to see the Tigers try something like the Braves did with Smoltz, move Verlander in as a closer, it would save his arm and he usually comes in a throws strikes right away, they could always move him back when Zumaya returns.
Ok, it's time to start holding these guys accountable. This should not be tolerated. I can't believe Leyland is settling for this. You can sense his frustration in his comments. If I were manager, this is what I'd do for a three or four game stretch.
- DL Sheff or release him - he's done, simle as that.
- Call up Mike Hessman. His #'s .307BA 18HR 31RBI
- Bench Cabrera and Renteria
- Lineup:
1. Granderson CF
2. Polanco 2B
3. Guillen DH
4. Ordonez RF
5. Joyce LF
6. Hessman 1B
7. Rodriguez C
8. Inge 3B
9. Santiago SS
Feel free to give me ANY reason why this wouldn't give us JUST as good of a chance to win than what we're going with now.
I dont get how people say we miss Inge's defense at 3rd. We havent had an error out of Guillen since he botched the Twins game. Get used to it. Guillen is our new 3rd baseman and thats where he belongs.
next time you watch them take the field, take a look how some of them walk to and from their positions. Then watch the Minnesota Twins do the same thing. It's night and day. They're not hungry, they're not motivated, and coaching changes will take place before you see anymore player movement.
Guillen doesn't have an error because he doesn't get to near as much as Inge did. He's definitely an upgrade over Cabrera at third though. Oh, and yes, a lot of people were blaming the Tigers troubles on Inge so I don't think anyone needs to be shutting up except perhaps...
However other than that, I generally agree with you souper. I'm about ready to send Pudge packing although I'm sure he's good at calling a game catching. Would love to see Inge get more play in the field or at catcher, but his hitting just isn't up to par. Just seems like the Tigers have a bunch of players who expect to win rather than play with passion and fire to make a win. Reminds me of some of the playoff flameouts the Red Wings had from 2003-2006. I can't hardly watch the games anymore.
Well whoever has been blaming Inge is dumb because he hasnt even been playing. What it boils down to is there is a serious lack of hitting and pitching (although it has been better) on this team. Whether it be from inability to lack of desire. Its sick that Leyland comes out day after day to placate and coddle this no winning waste of a team. "Their trying their best." BS. If they were theyd be winning. Its like we have a team Manny Ramirez's that cant hit.
The broom is ready to come out in K.C, they we face maybee the toughest team in baseball in the DBacks.When is Leyland going to admit the team dosn't play for him, they don't respect him.Bring Gibson back from Arizona
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• Galarraga perfect into seventh, Tigers roll 7/23/2008, 6:38 p.m. EDT
• Galarraga perfect into 7th as Tigers sweep Royals 7/23/2008, 6:17 p.m. EDT
• Rogers picks up victory over Royals 7/23/2008, 2:48 a.m. EDT
